149 won't start
 

Hey guys,
I can't get my 149 to start, there is no spark, a couple months ago it lost spark and the problem was the power wire to the coil, the spark used to come and go, now it won't come back and I tried cleaning the points and they look good, they don't even spark, so is this a bad coil?

Nikster do you have a 12v test light? Light should be lit with key on and also in start position on positive (+) side of coil. Light should flash when cranking on negative side of coil. If positive side not lit, back track to key switch and connections. How are you checking spark?

Here's how I would diagnose no spark, in this sequence.

1. Make sure you have 12v+ at the positive side of the coil with the switch "on." Use test light/VOM from the Pos terminal to a good ground.

2. If yes, verify points closing. Remove wire to points from the neg side of the coil. test for continuity from the end of this wire to a good ground as you rotate the engine. at various points in rotation, you should alternately get continuity (zero ohms) and infinite ohms (open circuit) indicating that the points are opening and closing.

2a. If no 12v+ at the coil, go back to the ignition switch and look for power.

3. If you are getting continuity at the points (opening and closing) Check the coil. turn the ignition switch off and remove all wires from the coil. Use the VOM to test the resistance of the coil. should be about 8 ohms. Place the pos and neg leads of the VOM to the pos and neg terminals of the coil. If much less (6 or less) or infinite, you've got a bad coil. replace it.

3a. If you are not getting continuity across the points, check connections to and at the points. The wire to the points should be checked for continuity. Clean points with fine sandpaper and try the test again.

4. Check/replace the plug wire.
5. Check/replace the plug itself
6. Replace the condenser

Another test you can do is take a known good battery/jump pack and run a small wire from the 12v+ side of the jump pack to the pos terminal of the coil, clamp the neg lead to the engine's ground. Then touch the positive clamp momentarily to the start terminal of the starter. The engine should start and run. This is one way to rule out problems with your ignition circuit.

This is also another way to test run your engine w/o the rest of the wiring in place.

Sounds like a good plan SDD.

Mike, yes I am using a test light, and yes there is power to the positive side of the Coil. I will check the negative side.

No more power out of the coil, I tested it on my 122 and that does perfectly, do I need a new coil?

No,
Just take the one off the 122.:biggrin2:

:biggrin2: tried a different coil that I know is good, still nothing, tried to clean points already , is it a condenser?

I blame this mess on lew for selling us a lemon.:biggrin2:

I like lemonade...
run a clean piece of paper between the points and see what happens.

Lol, ok will do.

Have you verified "test #2" as stated in SDD's post?

Money works good, too. Might be dirty though. Bennies work the best, but a single works in a pinch. No kiddin'. When looking at a cub, I pulled out a bill, ran it between the points, and she fired right up! Almost cost me that extra bill for the cub though. :bash2: :biggrin2:

That's cool josh.:biggrin2:

Not yet I haven't.

Nick thank you for acknowledging my post. My test light flashing on the negative side method is testing the positive in to the positive side of the coil and through to the negative side. With no negative applied to the coil (points closed), positive potential will be on both sides of the coil, hence the test light being lit on both sides. When points close, test light should go off on negative side only, but still stay lit on positive side. So, when cranking, points opening and closing, test light should flash on and off quickly on negative side of coil if there is good continuity through points and ground side. See Jons technical Tuesday post on static timing, uses test light for exact points closure.

Thanks mike, the test light doesn't light up at all when I touch either side of the coil while cranking it.

You need to trace the circuit back to your key switch, ignition terminal, maybe bad connection there or bad key switch. Battery positive comes in on batt terminal of key switch then out to coil positive with key on as well as cranking position, has to be there or no sparky

good advice Alvy,How u making out there Nick?

I will continue on it today. After I go look at some cubs for sale....

The tractor cranks so how can it be the ignition switch.:bigthink: still no spark, maybe bad points?

I have been through ignition switch problems twice in the last few months. Yes the ingnition switch can pass voltage to the starter solenoid, and not pass voltage to the coil. The ignition switches get corroded/rusted and no longer work properly. In my case, the contacts were so bad that it started to melt the wire harness connector on the back of the switch. The switch connections from battery were solid and clean, so were the ones to the start solenoid. But the connections for the charge circuit and coil were ate up. Once you pull the switch out and inspect the harness connector, and the functions of the switch with a meter, you should be able to narrow it down in a hurry. Good luck, TB

Thanks tb.

If you are getting power TO the pos. side of the coil in BOTH the "run" AND "start" positions, but no power TO the end of the wire that connects to the points (you really need to remove that wire from the points (leave it attached to the coil) and see if there is power to it (with your test light) when grounded to the engine and the key in BOTH the start and run positions)...

Power to the POS, side of the coil (in start and run) but no power to the Neg. side of the coil (with everything hooked up as it should be).

Then the coil is bad, the wire from the neg. side of the coil is bad or the points aren't making contact and then "breaking" as they should.

Is there some reason that you can not check each of these items interdependently of each other? An Ohm meter and/or a test light and continuity tester will tell you everything you ever wanted to know about each of these components.

For the record: I NEVER use sand/emery paper/cloth or an emery board to clean points! There is too much risk of the mineral coming off of each of these and becoming lodged between the points, preventing them from making contact. Use a POINT FILE and you will never experience this problem.

On your "About Me"page, it states that you have 20 Cubs... Is there not one of these other 19 Cubs that you can't borrow a coil from to check this 149?

Have you run a jumper wire from the pos. side of your battery to the pos. side of the coil and then tried to start this engine yet?

I tried a new coil and condenser from another cub, nothing... Then I tried a new fuse under the dash, nothing... I can try a jumper wire from the battery to the coil, thee is no power what so ever at the coil.

Ignition switch and plug look ok.

I must have mis-read an earlier post, I thought you had power to the pos. side of the coil... My mistake.

Try a jumper wire to the pos side of the coil from the pos. battery post then and see what happens.

The ignition switch can go bad (on the inside) and not let electricity through to the coil.

Ok, no problem, the weird thing is, it did have power to the positive side of the coil, then it went away.

Ok, I took the wire off the points, now I have power to both sides of the coil, so is it a bad wire or points?

I put the original coil and condenser back on and there is still power, I guess they are still good.

Check the wire to see if power goes through it.

If it does, then drag a dollar bill through the points, to clean any oil or grime out of them.

Reattach the wire, turn the crankshaft until the points are VERY closed, turn the key on, then open and close the points (manually) with a screwdriver, they should spark a little when you open them.

I touched the wire with the testlight and it's good.

Ok I did everything u said to do, they spark with the screwdriver, now what.:bigthink:

If your timing is right and you have fuel, it should start and run.

did it start?
who did you buy that POS off of anyway...hehehehe

If you are using a jumper wire to the coil from the battery, don't leave it on there too long with the engine not running... Or you WILL need a new coil!

If you are using a jumper wire from the battery to the coil to get power to the points, and you don't have power to the coil from the ignition switch, then the ign. switch is probably bad, or the wire from the ign. switch to the coil is bad.

If the ignition switch is bad, I would call the crook who sold it to you and tell him that you want a WORKING ignition switch!

Oops, spark plug wire was off, started right up.:beerchug: thanks guys for the help.

Was that the problem the whole time????

As funny as that is, the spark plug wire on my 1200 jumped right off the plug once. I had the crimp it down a little to make it a tighter fit. Glad you got it going. TB

No, That is why it wouldn't start after I cleaned the points.