129 hydro issue

cooperino · #1 06-23-2018, 06:36 PM

So here is what transpired in post before I was asked to move post and rightfully so...

Original question,
Maybe one of you Hydro guys can tell me about this. I started it up. Raised the idle to about half I touched the hydro control forward and WOW.. Damn thing did a wheelie. Glad I didn't push it all the way. I tried this a few more times and man that thing is way more responsive and touchy than my 1211. No funny noises, its responsive in reverse also. It really really surprised me though. It feels fine as I said. If I slowly engage it and go slowly faster and faster I can control the response. Is this normal on these older hydros?

My findings,
So, from the bolts under seat and foot rests it actually looked like no one has ever had it apart to mess with trunnion. That's the good news. Looking at trunnion I do see 2 corners on same side have very slight wear. Is this enough to cause the wholeshot wheelies I'm getting ? From what I was reading wear like this usually causes speed fluctuations and coasting type issues.

cooperino · #2 06-23-2018, 06:37 PM

Response to findings and last post.. Any help would be appreciated

Originally Posted by cooperino View Post
So, from the bolts under seat and foot rests it actually looked like no one has ever had it apart to mess with trunnion. That's the good news. Looking at trunnion I do see 2 corners on same side have very slight wear. Is this enough to cause the wholeshot wheelies I'm getting ? From what I was reading wear like this usually causes speed fluctuations and coasting type issues.
No... it shouldn't be causing issues like that.
Maybe the friction nut is adjusted too tight on the hydro lever....?
__________________
Jonathan
"They say money doesn't buy happiness....... but it does buy Cub Cadets, and Cub Cadets make me VERY happy!"

Runners: 1050, 1811, 185LB, JD 317
On the "back burner": 2-71's, 1250DS, 1000, 582, 682, 982, JD 318.
I have over 30 implements/attachments! IH, Cub Cadet, Brinly, Agrifab, and more!

Quote:
Originally Posted by cooperino View Post
I just went out to garage and with the engine off the lever actually moved very freely. When running you feel what I think is normal resistance. Not sure how I missed this. Before but I see the fan is long gone off the shaft. Could years of running this way be what's causing my issue now from prior over heating? Either way I'll be doing some welding ... The safety switch lever is also gone lol. I've been hot wiring the coil to start it. I assumed the safety switch itself was bad and almost ordered one. Mine is good tho.
Have you ever driven a left hand hydro tractor? They're a bit different. Not as much motion in the handle, so you have to move it differently. You sure you're not just moving it too fast? Nothing you are saying sounds out of line.... other than you popped a wheelie. Which I can honestly say I have never done on a CC. No, a lost fan and an overheated hydro would not cause the issue. If it had been overheated, it would be weak, not aggressive.

I don't know what to tell you. Check all the linkage out, see if everything is moving like it should. Make sure the cam plate and the swashplate control arm move independent of each other. You should see the springs compress when you move the dash lever and it starts to move. Might not be much, but the two plates should be free from each other.

As far as the safety switch, just put a jumper wire in it for now until you get it fixed. Quit jumping the solenoid. Tape the switch on or something....

Go start a thread on it too. This is just supposed to be a "show and tell" thread, not a question thread.
__________________
Jonathan
"They say money doesn't buy happiness....... but it does buy Cub Cadets, and Cub Cadets make me VERY happy!"

Runners: 1050, 1811, 185LB, JD 317
On the "back burner": 2-71's, 1250DS, 1000, 582, 682, 982, JD 318.
I have over 30 implements/attachments! IH, Cub Cadet, Brinly, Agrifab, and more!

cooperino · #3 06-23-2018, 06:47 PM

Ok so to answer Jonathan's questions. No have not driven left hand hydro but how different should it feel from a 1211? Power and ratios can't be that drastic can they? Im not ramming the lever forward quickly or anything like that.

I checked all the linkage and everything seems to move freely and easily.

Quote J-Mech
As far as the safety switch, just put a jumper wire in it for now until you get it fixed. Quit jumping the solenoid. Tape the switch on or something....

LOL.. Ill keep jumping the solenoid all I damn want because Im not using a screwdriver crossing the post and melting the crap out of them.. Long time mechanic remember?? I have the proper tools to do what im doing. While Im welding the trunnion "might as well since I have it apart" I will also weld the safety switch lever. I dont want to jumper it because god forbid I forget to take the jumper out my son could come along and start it...

Heres the correct tool for jumping solenoid.

I really do appreciate your help tho Jonathon and thank you.

J-Mech · #4 06-23-2018, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooperino

Ok so to answer Jonathan's questions. No have not driven left hand hydro but how different should it feel from a 1211? Power and ratios can't be that drastic can they? Im not ramming the lever forward quickly or anything like that.

Ratio's are very different. Power is the same. Hydro's are the same. Linkage is different.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooperino

I checked all the linkage and everything seems to move freely and easily.

Well, again.... I don't know. Still sounds like operator error. The pic of the springs look fine. Sure it has some wear, but nothing that bad. Spring isn't broken is it? Are both springs present?

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooperino

LOL.. Ill keep jumping the solenoid all I damn want because Im not using a screwdriver crossing the post and melting the crap out of them.. Long time mechanic remember?? I have the proper tools to do what im doing. While Im welding the trunnion "might as well since I have it apart" I will also weld the safety switch lever. I dont want to jumper it because god forbid I forget to take the jumper out my son could come along and start it...

Put a jumper wire in. You can remove the key to keep the kid from starting it. It does have a key doesn't it??

cooperino · #5 06-23-2018, 07:06 PM

I dont know about the operator error part. I have driven lots of hydro type vehicles and tractors and never had one react like this. If you read my first post what im saying is i barely touch this thing and it moves. Any tiny bit more than barely moving it and it takes off hard!.... I know how things are built and I doubt Cub would ever put out something that was suppose to feel this herky jerky. You may not trust my judgment but I would love to see your reaction if you drove this thing.

cooperino · #6 06-23-2018, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Put a jumper wire in. You can remove the key to keep the kid from starting it. It does have a key doesn't it??

Yeah.. it has a key.. Same damn universal key his tractor has.. Crazy Jon, Not stupid

sawdustdad · #7 06-23-2018, 09:09 PM

I've found the "responsiveness" of the hydro to vary on my various hydro tractors. The 149 is pretty quick to respond, the 1650 is a bit slow. I'm not sure if there is a difference due to relief valves or some other internal function.

Moving the trunnion arm tilts the swashplate in the hydro, changing the amount and direction of fluid from the drive pump to the driven pump.

Have you changed the fluid in the rear end? Is it proper spec'd fluid? If it were very low viscosity, it might react differently than a more viscous hydraulic fluid.

Maybe there is even water in there? Heaven forbid.

Just trying to think about what might be different about this tractor for you...

J-Mech · #8 06-23-2018, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooperino

I dont know about the operator error part. I have driven lots of hydro type vehicles and tractors and never had one react like this. If you read my first post what im saying is i barely touch this thing and it moves. Any tiny bit more than barely moving it and it takes off hard!.... I know how things are built and I doubt Cub would ever put out something that was suppose to feel this herky jerky. You may not trust my judgment but I would love to see your reaction if you drove this thing.

Post a video or something. No, it shouldn't take off like a shot, but like in how much movement? Like 1/4"? 1"? How far? On the right hand dash lever models, you have to move most of them a good 1" or more for it to do about anything. Not so much on the others.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooperino

Yeah.. it has a key.. Same damn universal key his tractor has.. Crazy Jon, Not stupid

It shouldn't have an Indak key switch. Should have an IH key switch. Better make sure it's wired right.

flatpickerray · #9 06-23-2018, 09:23 PM

Yes, I would weld up them grooves in the trunnion arm. That could be your problem or at least part of it. You see, them end caps on the springs get caught in the groove then abruptly comes out as you engage the lever, causing a quick response.

cooperino · #10 06-23-2018, 09:41 PM

Thanks all, I will be draining the fluid tomorrow I hope. It still has whatever the PO had in it and I thought about that actually as being an issue..

Jon, Yeah if i move it about a half an inch in sort of not slow but not fast motion. Thats when it gets jerky. Any faster and or farther than that man it gets a little scary. Im not timid. My pro stock drag car runs 8's and will get nasty if you come out of the hole to hot but Im not use to this on a tractor lol.

It seems like all the responsive movement is in the first inch even though the spectrum of the lever itself seems to be more like 3 inches. A relief valve might really make sense hear. It feels like I am getting full hydraulic pressure very quickly.

Ill look more tomorrow. Thanks for the input all.