1440 Vanguard

Mike McKown · #1 11-01-2014, 08:25 PM

For reference:

I drug this POC 1440 home the other day simply because it had good/salvageable plastic on it. Turns out the seller says the engine runs good. It's been sitting outside for probably 4-5 years in the weather.

Before I part it out, I try to start the engine. Really slow crank speed but has spark on both plugs. I oil up the cylinders and get it to spin a little faster and the thing fires and runs with brake cleaner shooting in the carb. Briefly.

So, to fix the slow cranking, I take the starter motor off. Clean the armature, brushes, inside of the housing out. Lube it up and put it back together. It now spins the engine like it should but won't start.

No spark! Either plug. Engine loom disconnected so ignition ground isn't in the equation.

I put an ohmmeter on the coil terminal on the blower housing. Shows no resistance. My VOM won't check diodes per the B&S check prodedure. but I believe both of them are defective.

Sounds right? Dont' know why they both quit at the same time.

dvogtvpe · #2 11-01-2014, 09:33 PM

sure you didn't pinch a wire or leave one off ? hook something up wrong?

Mike McKown · #3 11-02-2014, 06:44 AM

The only wire(s) I could have pinched would have been the stator wires that go behind the starter. AFAIK, grounding them won't kill the ignition spark.

I had all the wires to the engine harness unhooked. I just used jumper cables to the starter motor and ground cable. That's the only wires it should take to start it.

Sam Mac · #4 11-02-2014, 08:14 AM

Mike

If it was me, I would pull the engine out, clamp it to the work bench, pull the blower housing, remove the kill wires to the mags, hook up power to the fuel shut down solenoid, hook up a fuel supply and a battery to the starter and light it up. The pic is a CH on my bench.

Mike McKown · #5 11-02-2014, 10:50 AM

Looks like I haven't overlooked anything so pulling the engine and blower housing was going to be my next move. I just didn't want to have to do that just yet.

It just seems strange that BOTH cylinders would go dead at the same time for no apparent reason.

Can someone refresh my memory the difference between a 14/16 hp Vanguard?

J-Mech · #6 11-02-2014, 11:00 AM

Nothing. Same thing.

If you lost both engines at the same time, the mags have to be grounded. That is way more likely than both mags failing at the same time. Your either missing something, or there's a bare wire in the blower housing.

Mike McKown · #7 11-02-2014, 11:01 AM

I did some more scratching around here.

http://www.onlycubcadets.net/forum/s...light=vanguard

See Oaks response #8 to a similar question on another 16 Vanguard a few months ago.

Thanks.

Oak · #8 11-02-2014, 11:26 AM

Mike, I'm not sure that you can ohm out the primary side of the coils from that terminal because of the diodes. Did you ohm out the secondary side from the plug boots and compare it to what the manual says? Can you pull the shroud off and pull the kill wire off of each coil or ohm it there?

Sam Mac · #9 11-02-2014, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike McKown

For reference:

I drug this POC 1440 home the other day simply because it had good/salvageable plastic on it. Turns out the seller says the engine runs good. It's been sitting outside for probably 4-5 years in the weather.

Before I part it out, I try to start the engine. Really slow crank speed but has spark on both plugs. I oil up the cylinders and get it to spin a little faster and the thing fires and runs with brake cleaner shooting in the carb. Briefly.

So, to fix the slow cranking, I take the starter motor off. Clean the armature, brushes, inside of the housing out. Lube it up and put it back together. It now spins the engine like it should but won't start.

No spark! Either plug. Engine loom disconnected so ignition ground isn't in the equation.

I put an ohmmeter on the coil terminal on the blower housing. Shows no resistance. My VOM won't check diodes per the B&S check prodedure. but I believe both of them are defective.

Sounds right? Dont' know why they both quit at the same time.

Mike

What I'm having problems with is it had spark and now it doesn't. Check the kill wire connection, disconnect the wire shown with the red arrow, that's the kill wire and see if you get spark. If by chance it starts you can shut it off by grounding it at this connection.

Mike McKown · #10 11-02-2014, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam Mac

Mike

What I'm having problems with is it had spark and now it doesn't. Check the kill wire connection, disconnect the wire shown with the red arrow, that's the kill wire and see if you get spark. If by chance it starts you can shut it off by grounding it at this connection.

Sam. As I posted above. I had ALL the wires off the tractor/engine harness including the yellow wire. I know that is the kill wire.

I'm going to pull the engine in a few minutes and disconnect the coil ground wires and see what happens.